Disabled parking

I totally agree about the double standards!.. I don't have a blue badge so have to pay for parking anyway but the parking here is a total joke! The best thing you can do if you get a ticket is to appeal it. Apparently about 70%+ of all tickets get overturned on appeal!

Andy, are the car parks run by Weymouth council? Do Weymouth Council also provide "On Street" Blue Badge parking bays? If they do then BB holders have a choice. In the Borough I am using as an example there is no choice because there is nowhere else to park because the council do not provide any "On Street" bays and have put no loading lines on all the double yellow lines (there are no single lines, making it impossible to find anywhere else to park other than their car parks.

There is only one small road which has the town hall offices in it that has some yellow lines that BB holders can and do park on (around 6 cars). This is the only free parking anywhere. The councillors mean time enjoy free parking in any car park in the borough, this is supposed to be only on civic duties but there is nothing to stop them from using the car parks whenever they want. Double standards I think!

Come to Weymouth because Blue Badge holders have to pay in all car parks at all times!

Member- sorry but without a name I cannot address you! I did not say that I (i.e. me) believed that anyone should have free parking or not, I was simply stating what the facts where(please read my post again). For the record I actually do think they should for the reasons the BB scheme adopted it.

So you are clear, the reason that it would be unfair in this instance is because the Blue Badge scheme gives a concession to the people who are given the badges for 3 hours free parking, either in "on street" disabled bays or on single yellow or double yellow lines (if not obstructing), or in normal parking bays. By not providing any of these concessions and doing as I stated above they are denying BB holders the concessions that they the council give them in the first place by providing them with a badge!

Obviously the scheme adopted free parking for the very reasons that Matthew has highlighted and because many disabled have to load and unload equipment into and out of their cars which also takes additional time. Where as you may be fortunate enough to be able to work and therefore afford to pay the extortionate rates to park, there are many who can ill afford these charges and in any case there is a principle at stake. Nowhere in the rest of the county is any disabled being charged to park "on street" or in a car park (and I doubt many places across the country apart from London) unless the barrier or ticketing system physically cannot cope with the individual difference of a disabled ticket, but the BB holder will have a choice not to enter that car park and go else where to park near by and park for free. In other words it is not a blanket policy as it is in this particular borough.

If you feel particularly strongly about paying for parking then by all means pay to park but dont judge everyone by your standards. Those that live on disabled benefits need all the help they can get, so if the government has given them a concession, why should they not be given the facility to use it?

Anonymous - I think the point is that, where an able-bodied person could make the choice to park further away from their intended destination for free, this choice is not there for the less able-bodied people.

I agree with the fee being waived for disabled badge holders as otherwise you are making money off the backs of people who have no choice but to park there.

There is also the issue that in general it takes longer for disabled people to go about their business and to get from place to place. This means that they need to be parked for longer and thus it could end up costing them more as a direct result of their disability.

I would happily pay for parking any day if it meant being able to walk to the shops without any pain and at a decent pace.

Although I agree in principle with you Carole, I don't understand or agree on why you believe a person should have 'free parking' simply because they have a disability. I'm not sure 'I can't earn as much as non-disabled' could constitute as an argument for subsidised parking. I have been disabled most of my life but that certainly doesn’t prevent me, nor do I expect it to, from putting my hand into my wallet for basic commodities. Something which everyone does regardless of blue badge ownership or not. I pay taxes as much as anyone and I must admit I’d feel begrudged to know yet more of my hard earned wages are going to people who don’t actually need a subsidy but are large enough in numbers to make waves.

It makes sense to me that the council will want to monitor the spaces for usage...threatening to remove them, if not used, is obviously a poor show of management and PR on the councils part. Out of interest, which council are you saying that are making these ludicrous statements?

Ruth makes good points and the reason she does is because like me she deals with an Access group and therefore has insight into the issues faced by Blue Badge Holders. The public perception of a disabled person seems to be of somebody in a wheelchair (perhaps the signs themselves dont help) when a high proportion of people who are awarded them actually have what would be termed a "hidden" disability, one which is not obvious to another person but just as deserving of a badge.

The other misconception is that these badges are just handed out willy nilly. Again in the vast majority of areas now they are strictly controlled with applicants made to pass stringent walking tests if they have not been able to pass the criteria, one of which is Higher rate DLA for Mobility. In the past this was not always the case which has lead to the high number of fraudulent badges in circulation and the notion in the publics mind that just anyone can get hold of one and therefore they are not worth the paper they are written on.

There will always be those that will be selfish and jealous of people who they perceive are getting something that they cant have. The fact that those people have lost so much, are fighting for their dignity and without these concessions would become segregated and dependant on others has not even crossed the minds of those selfish few. What is needed is education and transparency.

Unfortunately if my local authority is anything to go on, there seems to be an active and growing culture of discrimination against BB drivers. They refuse to allow any "on street" BB parking, instead corralling disabled drivers into car parks which they are now making them pay for. Because they added more disabled bays in the car parks in exchange for starting charging, they have now started to monitor the usage of the bays and are threatening to revert them back to normal bays if they are not in constant use. The councillors in my local area obviously think that the disabled are not valued in their local shopping area and are driving them away. I thought this behaviour was outlawed - obviously I was wrong.

Good post Ruth! I agree with your comments and appreciate especially your point relating to non-wheelchair users. I am one of the latter (and a BB holder) and often need to open my car door fully in order to get in or out depending on my condition at the time, and with having some limb immobilisation. Many are the times that I have been trapped in or kept out of my car due to inconsiderate people.

Going back to one of the responses to the original question, it was said that a wheelchair user needs the extra space to get out of the car. This group is not the only group of disabled people who need the extra space. Someone who has mobility impairment (such as arthritis or MS or cerebral palsy) who is not a wheelchair user may need to open their car door fully in order to swing their legs around to be able to get out of the car. That person may be the driver or the passenger. Such people, once up and walking, may not be perceived to be disabled in any way. Therefore the average person assumes that they are fraudulent. Like many access groups mine deals all the time with complaints from Blue Badge holders about lack of appropriate spaces, being misappropriated and violent outbursts from non-disabled people who seem to think that they should be able to park near to the store even when there are numerous empty spaces available. In my local Sainsburys in Salford (surprise surprise) there are numerous blue badge spaces, many of which do not get abused. That's because the people in Salford simply park their cars on the yellow cross hatchings right in front of the store (causing an obstruction for everyone) rather than walk even a few hundred metres to the store. This even when there is a car park full of empty spaces. Tell me, how do you propose to educate these people? I always remember the research carried out by the police which showed that people who abuse blue badge spaces are more likely to be breaking other traffic regulations. If the police came to Salford and took the numbers of the people who were parked on teh yellow cross hatchings, they would probably find that they were also not insured not moted not taxed etc.
On another note, I do remember how difficult it was when heavily pregnant standing upright on a bus and I was very grateful to all the kind souls (male, female, young, old) who offered me their seat when I was in this position, especially as I was concerned about teh possible outcome of falling over on not just me but on my unborn baby. I also remember not being able to find a seat at all when I had a two hour wait at London Euston when seven months' pregnant - there were no seats unoccupied anywhere that I could find and I ended up having to walk round and round the station because I could not stand still for long and I couldn't do what others were doing and sit on the floor because I would not have been able to get up again.

When is a Disabled Parking Space not a Disabled Space........Never is the answer!
Why is it then that evenings, weekends etc.......people without a Blue Badge use the limited spaces available? It's a common problem the spaces outside of our local Fitness First Gym are fair game for those that blatantly disregard the Law and have no thoughts for the Disabled members of our community as they go for a 'workout'. These particular spaces are also used by Costa Coffee, Greggs, G4S, Hertfordshire Highways and many others..oh I nearly forgot the Saturday Market and occassionaly specialist Sunday Markets who physically block all 3-spaces for their own use !
Anyway back to the subject matter......If someone is entitled to the Blue Badge under the current scheme then they are entitled to the minimal benefits attached to the scheme. If a Blue Badge Holder is parked in a Disabled bay and doesn't immediately get out of their vehicle what of it, maybe they might get out of their vehicle later...they can change their minds. There are so many stigmas attached to Disabled People, how they look(are they disabled how bad are they discbled) to what car they drive.
I don't condone violence but I can understand the frustrations of those with the Blue Badge who can't find anywhere to park as some inconsiderate person has 'just popped into the shop for 5-minutes' !

Thank you to all of you for providing such informative and interesting responses. This is the first time I have started a thread and I'm glad I have. I think that across all the replies, you have captured both the letter and spirit of the BB scheme as well as how we should behave towards each other generally. I now feel confident to clarify the use of our car park to the husband of our employee!

Thanks again

Julia

Hello

They appear to be both members of the public who appear fit enough to have a fight,

Barry L

This post has been removed because it contravened our guidelines.

Shall we go back to the original question?......"We had an incident this week where the husband of a member of staff got into a fight over a disabled parking space with a member of the public. He has a disabled badge but his wife is not disabled. We are a college. Does he have the right to challenge someone else as he only parks to collect his wife and has no other business at the college".

First of all the husband of the member of staff got into a fight over a disabled parking space with a member of the public. He is disabled with a Blue Badge but his wife, the member of staff is not.
The question was, does he have the right to challenge someone as he only parks to pick up his wife.
1. Julia did not specify why he was challenging a member of the public. We are assuming it was because perhaps they parked in a disabled bay without displaying a badge and were not disabled.
2. The Blue Badge scheme is only valid for "on street parking" . Any "off street parking" for the disabled, be it council parking or private land owners, is nothing to do with the Blue Badge scheme and is at the discretion of whoever the land is owned by .
3. If the husband wanted to air his views with a member of the public, we assume about parking wrongly in a disabled bay when they were not disabled, there is not much anyone can do about it, its called free speech (as long as they are not abusive).
4. Morally, the husband should not park to sit and wait for a non disabled person. It is against the Blue Badge scheme rules but because he committed this offence on private land there is nothing that can be done about it unless the college enforces their own parking rules which should be clearly displayed (but as a BB holder he should have known better).

I hope that is helpful Julia!

As a member of my local Access Group we are dealing with BB parking all the time. As I have said many times on here the real problem with it is communication - no one ever consults with the people that it affects. As a wheelchair user I am quite happy to park in a bay in a supermarket which is not close to the doors because once in my chair I am reasonably mobile. My problem is getting safe access to the store because of my height, as cars don't see me once seated. The people who need the disabled bays nearer the doors are those with sticks and who have walking and other disabilities. I know what its like to try to walk with shopping when you are in a lot of pain. People with other disabilities, often hidden so not always obvious, also need to be close to the doors.

With "on street" disabled parking these have been situated in specific places in towns after consultations with groups such as ours. Dropped curbs have been allocated as well as resting areas situated between the parking and shops. So when idiots that are not disabled park in these spots they have no idea the inconvenience they cause by taking up these precious spaces. For most disabled there is no alternative but to either wait for one to become available or to go home, its as simple as that. So please if you are tempted to just "pop" into one of these spaces to visit a shop, don't, or get frustrated with somebody who is half blocking a road waiting for one of these spaces, just think how lucky you are that you have a choice in where you can park.

And finally, if you know of anyone, or ever see anyone using a Blue Badge which belongs to somebody else, just take a photo of them leaving the car, one of the number plate and one of the BB in the car and send it into the local council which can be found on their website with the date and time - without saying anything to the person. The more people who do it the more will be done to cut out the fraud which blights the genuine people who need these badges and gives them such a bad name. In north London a sweep on one stretch of road in a few hours caught out about 20 false drivers whose fines and confiscations boosted the coffers of the local authority. Thank You.

Wayne - you are a credit to your mother - that is what is wrong with todays society. No morals, no respect, no showing SOME (as they are not all the same) young people you can offer courtesy without losing street cred. I am in my 50's a female and I get up to offer the older generation a seat if they wish it. Or somebody less able than me. It is nothing to do with being equal, sexist - it is manners.

This post has been removed because it contravened our guidelines.

This post has been removed because it contravened our guidelines.

This post has been removed because it contravened our guidelines.

This post has been removed because it contravened our guidelines.

The disabled parking bays is a safety issue.
As a disabled person may have mobility issues then the idea is for that person to get out of the car parking area asap. Similarly parent & child bays are near the shops etc.
A person with limited mobility or a child is in danger within an area where drivers are looking for a bay rather than observing everything around them.
I am amazed at the number of people who do not realise this and become 'experts' on a persons medical history because they cannot get their car parked.

Having had to travel by train and undderground for two weeks recently (I aplaude those who do this all the time) I was very plesently surprised to be offered a seat( i walk with the aid of a stick) by younger people on four occaisions in that two weeks. so there is still hope for the nation. As for parking as someone who has a blue badge I do get frustrated at the number of non badged cars in bays, however I also get very frustrated by the misuse of this valuable concession. Education is the key, but no one listens.

How is opening doors for ladies, and giving up your seat to an old lady not sexist in a real sense.

I have been brought up not to shut the door in the face of ANYONE, I really don't care what gender they are, If I'm going through a door and someone is following, I aint going to make sure they're female.

Same goes for riding on a bus or train, if I see someone that looks like they need a seat and I'm capable of standing, I will (and have) give it up for them.

I done this a few months ago, when a young guy who looked fine at first, turned white and started to sweat. I immediately gave him my seat, just before he was sick into his carrier bag.

Bit of a pet hate of mine, TBH.

As for misuse of blue badges, I quite agree that a sense of fairness should ensue, and it seems that evidence was available for the judgement call from the OP, whereas the supermarket story is the exact opposite.
My view is to let things be if no harm is being done, rather than make assumptions.

Years ago I used to pick up my wife and 2 very young daughters (not very young any more tho - sigh) from Tesco's after work, and would park in mother & child space (they were quite a new thing then) and have received abuse, yet never from someone that had children with them.

Neil, you're not entirely correct about being able to park anywhere with a blue badge. Holders are allowed to park on single and double yellow lines for a maximum of 3 hours and ONLY if they are not obstructing traffic or causing a hazard. They are not permitted to park in taxi bays, bus stops, red-lines or areas marked for loading (identified by a perpendicular double yellow line on the pavement - this actually covers an awful lot of what people assume are double yellow lines).

I do not think that the average blue badge holder is on a personal vendetta to make you walk further than they, nor do I think that disabled spaces on private land are provided to allow you to
"get our own back on those that take liberty with these badges"
The spaces are to allow those of us less mobile and more vulnerable than yourself to access basic services that you clearly take for granted.

If you really want to get your own back you might as well go and do star jumps in front of someone in a wheel chair and tease them for not being able to do the same?!!

This is where the United States are ahead of us as in such areas the parking spaces are enforceable by the local law enforcement and are so enforced. As someone who if there are no appropriate spaces available sometimes has to abandon shopping and either go to another supermarket or even give up altogether (sorry - something out of the freezer for tea tonight kids) I do hate it when people without badges park where they shouldn't even if it is not illegal. To the OP the husband had no right to the space as has already been clearly stated (if he is not leaving the car then he can't wait there for an able bodied person) so wasn't really in a position to be challenging anyone else.

I got up for an old lady on the bus the other day.

I don't know who was more embarrassed me or her. The other passengers stared at me for getting up, there was a long pause as the old lady caught up with the situation then they stared at her for taking the seat that I had previously occupied.

I initially felt good and the old lady probably thought I was an idiot for making everyone look at her.