Key Worker Holiday Entitlement

Kevin,

I take exception to your comments. If a tribunal finds against the employer, its usually because they haven't "dotted the i or crossed the t" - not because they are out and out wrong.

As I said, a lot of people on this board live in a world of HR best practice - I live in the real world, of struggling companies struggling to keep afload.

From my personal experience it is silly to have one person responsible foor a task.

I went to Business Link and earned an NVQ2 for Business Start-up, then started my business, Just me, a sole trader.

It was a private hire (taxi) service, and my USP was to operate within a specific area.
This was made easy by the 'big boys' operating a 'target' zone pricing scale which went from the centre of town.
My zones worked from a specific housing estate.
I dropped around 1000 leaflets through doors and expected a return of under 4% to start with (just 40), whilst nthe second lot wer being produced.

I had over 50% response, I was giving my work away to independant drivers and even the Big Boys.

And through sheer panic I worked myself to the bone.

If only I had had someone else, even if I had an independant driver sign up an agreement (which incidentally a case study that I learnt on my NVQ course had come up with that idea - yet I ignored)

Closing down a very succesful company simply because you cant manage the trade is silly.

Get someone else trained up in that field, before you lose a contract.

Hello

What occurs if the company also operates a use it or lose policy on hoildays,I am with Kevin on this regarding resiliance and continuity, not sure if only one person being able to carry ourt a task is a brilliant strategy, we are suffering on the thameslink service at the mo due to not enough staff being trained to operate the trains.

Regards

Barry

Isn't contingency planning a wonderful ideal? I, along with my other management colleagues, am providing cover for my staff over the Christmas period to ensure they get a decent break. A little forward planning by management and a little flexibility by everyone can generally sort this out. My main concern as a manager here would be - is the employee suffering financially as a result of being 'forced' to cancel their holiday arrangements? If its a matter of time off spent at home, the employee can rearrange, inconvenient but surely worth the 'brownie points'/recognition, and the firm gets its order out and the member of staff gets an appropriate reward- not just a pat on the back.

Charles, I agree with you whole heartedly about multi skilling, but we need to take a stance to look at this from a higher level than the shop floor.

Key workers are employed for their skills, experience, decision making, trust and responsibility. Those people who have been cross trained to cover such key workers are generally not of the same ilk and only deal with the day to day routines ensuring business continuity. When a company is in crisis (positive or negative) then you will want your key people in to ensure the right decisions are being made. Take it to another extreme if the company you work for is on the brink of administration how would you feel if the finance director says ' sorry I'm off on holiday?' or what if you had an out break of swine flu that's affected 30% of your workforce.......all leave has to be cancelled perhaps?

Its unfortunate but these things do happen from time to time

You all seem to be missing one key point - this key worker who is going to have his holiday cancelled as he is the only one that can do the job is going to walk and take his key skill elsewhere - if he is that good a competitor will soon grab him - Companies need to take care of their staff and respect them not to use legislation to force them into submission what century are we in - please remind me? As a manage I ensure all my staff can multi skill filling each others roles wherever possible

Julian, I agree that people are treating this in a matter of fact way and I think we've all wandered slightly from the original question, but it's irrelevant what this employees critial factor is, critical employees should not exist. They are the weak point in the Titanic hull of any business. There is only so much that they can be depended on before they fail and take everybody else with them.

Ford, my point is that people are jumping from one extreme to another and being so 'matter of fact' but we do not know what the critical factor is for the requirement of this employee to perhaps cancel his holiday do we.

Yes if you have covered yourself you can get over any situation if the said individual is not willing to cancel but there are odd occassions when you need your best team on the case, therefore these situations will happen from time to time

I think people are missing the point. You cannot rely on a single person always being present to enable a company to function, it is simply poor management practice to allow this to be in place.

It's irrelevant whether or not you can/can't force/ask/expect/bribe somebody to cancel their leave, there are times when this person simply may not be able to carry out their role.

I work in FM, and have cancelled leave, refused to cancel leave, worked after completing my notice period to help out a previous employer whilst having to explain this to the new one. I could and often do work extra unpaid hours because that's how I am, but I always remember that my loyalties lie with myself. To be happy, healthy and have life outside work.

Employers are fickle and this 'critical employee' could eventually be replaced by process or procedure at which point their 'loyalty' and willingness to sacrifice their time to their employer may not have its proper reward.

'Workplace what I can intimidate my employees into accepting?'

Sometimes its just inevitable, these things happen and at the end of the day if you are happy working for a company surly you should want to be a contributor to its success. You have to take each case on its own merit, when people post a posing question/dilemma on here everyone starts shouting employment regs, bad management, get off the golf course or staff being treated like doormats etc etc.

Kevin, as you use MBIFM (although I cant see why you have to on here) I take it you are an FM, therefore you most likely will have a deputy, policies, procedures in place to cover any eventuality/emergency within your premises. However all FM's are 24/7 365 days a year on call and most likely would cancel or even return from holiday early if it was important enough. What if your company had an emergency and you had to find alternative premises urgently would you not cancel your holiday or would you prefer them to get in a consultant?

We cant afford to have 'Doubles' everywhere we work but sometimes we have to take stock of where our loyalties lay and just get on with it, the last thing I would want is a project FM consultant stepping in because I'm off for a couple of weeks. Being involved in dealing with crisis management after the Baltic Exchange, 99 Bishopsgate and Docklands bombings it makes you realise when there is a crisis this is when your experience really counts and probably why that company has employed you in the first place.

You don't hear about the Police or armed forces moan when an emergency crops up and 'all leave is cancelled' do we, otherwise we would be in a sorry state.

Recognition, or compensation? Coerced or volunteered? Doormat or valued employee? James, if a tribunal finds against you it's because you're in the wrong. The website is called Workplace Law, not Workplace What I Can Intimidate My Employees Into Accepting.
Anyone with an ounce of sense about business continuity and resilience will make sure that the absence of 'critical' workers doesn't unduly affect the way their business operates.

Yup - and he'll get a tribunal award for £10,000 which forces the company into liquidation - result nobody wins.

If an employee of mine offered to change his own holiday plans then this is something which would get recognition.

I cannot beleive some of the comments, lets look at the facts, the employee requested his leave in accordance with his terms and conditions, it is accepted by the employer, this then forms a contract as all parties have agreed. The employee has booked and paid for his holiday another contract.
The company then falls back on the working time regulations, and starts useing these regulations to prevent the employee taking his agreed booked and accepted annual leave, the employee has an agreed holiday, he takes it, and is dismissed by the company for being un reasonable, what tribunal is going to accept this as reasonable grounds, I think none. The employee would win hands down.
In reality the company could request that the employee considers an alternative date for the holiday but must accept that the employee may have to decline, it could be that there are more than 2 people involved in the holiay, it could be a family group going, are they prepaired to compensate for the financial loss, I doubt it.
Let the employee take the holiday, request an extension to the bid time.
But lets all stop looking at these regulations and trying to hide behind them, lets all be good managers before the regulations were made available to hide behind.

James, I don't think that it's being bl***y minded to expect to take a holiday that has been booked and paid for, even in the current economic climate.
Sounds to me that the management have not ensured that they have covered all business risk by having one person who can carry out a vital role.

It all depends whether this particular worker is going to be realistic (noting the recession and all) or if they want to be bl***y minded about it.

Hello Shaun
If there are no other holiday arrangements or agreements within the company, in this instance you would fall back to the Working Time Regulations. The Working Time Regulations does allow employers to stipulate when annual leave can be taken, it also allows the employer to give counter-notice requiring that leave not be taken. In this instance you would be required to give notice that is the equivalent to the length of holiday that has been requested. However in your instance you may want to give longer so that alternative plans can be made. You must, however, still allow the individual the opportunity to take their full leave entitlement for the year. I hope that this helps. Suzanne.

I agree with Ford.

Did the managers call a meeting? and ask for volunteers? surely if they have a new order they could at least 'dangle a decent carrot'?

And why is just one worker essential to the whole operation, yet again lazy inept management it seems.

Relying absolutely on one person isn't effective management.

Is this holiday a company shut down? or has the essential staff member booked a holiday?

no it's not reasonable if the holiday was booked in advance, and only haveing one person able to complete a particular task sounds like poor management procedures are in place. What on earth would the company do if the person was suddenly taken ill?

Is it reasonable for key workers to have their holidays cancelled at the last moment due to company workload & what is the legal position for both Employer and Employee?

The circumstances in question are that in the interim between booking the time off for the holiday and the actual date of the holiday a significant order has been won for work that requires turning around within the proposed holiday period and this cannot be completed without a particular worker being present...there is nothing in the Employees T&C's to sugest that this may happen and the holidays are within the 'normal' entitlement. I acknowledge, particularly in the current climate that there is an element of reasonableness on both parties but I would like to understand the respective legal positions, please advise.