Help for my daughter

Some practical advice for your daughter - avoid employment relationships completely, and do something whereby she rents a chair/rents a bed to another person of a similar level (with ideally some client following).

So long as the correct procedure is followed, and all legal obligations are completed correctly, it doesn't really matter what you call the warnings (within reason obviously). Many companies still use the phrase "Verbal Warning", "Written Warning" etc when in fact written confirmation of the warning is still given.

Absolutely correct Karl, and fully agree with your second para. as this is something that has caused many a downfall in an employers case where they didn't confirm the verbal warning.

No such thing as a "Verbal warning"? The current template disciplinary procedures from ACAS use "first warning", "second warning", final warning, etc, but if a disciplinary policy uses the phrases "verbal warning", "written warning", etc, there is no reason not to continue with these. (But then, personally I wouldn't recommend the ACAS template for employers - too weak, they don't give you too many options for disciplinary action, more helpful to employees than employers.)

Of course, often an area of confusion, good practice is to confirm in writing that a verbal warning has been issued. This wouldn't change it into a written warning, but is simply a record of the warning.

Anyway, hopefully this case can be taken care of promptly & effectively, and Stephen's daughter can grow her business and bring on efficient staff with her.


Karl Limpert

Just a short note....there is no such thing as a ''Verbal Warning'' anymore !

Stephen, time for tough love, your daughter stands more chance of being bankrupted by this person than ever reaching a tribunal as being let down and messed around is gonna loose more clients than she already has with bad PR.

She is a liability and will clean ya daughter out before moving on to next victim.

Valuable lesson for her as she is gonna have to grow some and already worrying that she is NOT more protective of "her business" than someone elses feelings of rejection - better she find out now that she can't cope and jacks it in immediately as gonna cost a lot more later as stock overdraft turnover builds etc.

Good God This person is really taking the ........! Feels like she can just pop in and out when she feels like it, call, text or just get somebody else to when she cant be bothered! Are you sure she does not have yet somewhere else she is working and goes there when she has a job lined up?

Do as Karl says you have nothing to worry about. I have never heard of such audacity!!

There is no real possibility of an employment tribunal, as there is nothing to make a claim on - in most instances, an employee couldn't claim for unfair dismissal unless they had a year of service.

If the employee can contact her friend to discuss their sickness, they can contact the employer too. The best thing to do would be to dismiss the employee now, and hire someone suitable instead.


Karl Limpert

She came back in on Saturday, they had a discussion and it seemed to clear the air (may have been a verbal warning) Her next day was today, my daughter received a call this morning from the employee,s friend saying she would not be in today because of sickness. She has been paid for the hours worked so far but not Saturday, cant prove she attended the other job, she is due in tomorrow with several bookings but who knows if she will show up. My advice would be tell her not to return and pay her for this week, my daughter is afraid an industrial tribunal would take much needed funds from this business which is only 7 months old.

You missed out the most important bit of information we needed to hear Karl!

If she attended another job but failed to turn up to your daughters employment - and you can prove that (cos she could say she was just attending the other place to pick something up or whatever) - then you can do what Karl says. You have no obligation to pay her anything just sack her for gross misconduct.

Write her a letter and tell her that due to her non attendance, no formal written explanation and no certification to cover her absence and the fact that she was seen attending and working else where (name the company) you have no alternative but to terminate her immediately for Gross misconduct with no notice.

Sounds to me like she was taking you for a ride from day one or took the job to see what it was like at the same time as the other one and was trying you both out. However she needs to learn some honesty. Perhaps next time you can draw up a little contract stating what is expected of the employee when absent, sick or whatever in the probationary period so they and you both know where you stand. A few minutes now might well save you lots more in the future.

The person had another job which they went on to attend? Was this the same day?

If my understanding of this is correct, I'd scrap the idea of a week's pay, and summarily dismiss them for gross misconduct!


Karl Limpert

Many thanks for all the advice I think the one week.s notice is the best idea, the person had another job which they managed to attend so i think my daught should start again and try and find someone else
Many thanks once again

It could be that she is genuinely unwell & just doesn't realise the correct way to inform you (your daughter). On the other hand if she isn't going to be any good for the long term then why waste another weeks money?
I know it is tough enough running a small business but you need to establish whether or not she wants her new job - make contact, by phone or a visit. If she is unwell you can give heranother chance & she may turn out well, but she may agree she doesn't really want to return, if which case its the quickest way to find out & you save the weeks money.
You don't need to act quite in the same way as a large company would but you need to keep a record of what is happening, if you have a claim for unfair dismissal then it would be no good claiming that you didn't hear anything after the initial text - she has advised that she is sick & presumably hasn't been told she should maintain regular contact.
If both parties agree the employment should end then follow up with a letter, politely written & thanking her, but confirming you have both agreed she doesn't work for you anymore. Don't forget you need to be polite & reasonable here, it is so easy not to be when one member of staff can have such a dramatic effect on a small business, but that doesn't mean you should waste money in doing so.

This is not big business with a shed load of employees and an HR department full of employment lawyers it's not even an SME it's a one plus women outfit where the new person has not made it past the first week of induction let alone probation period without failing in their mutual obligation to conduct their relationship in a reasonable manner as a reasonable person or as an employee.

Doesn't bode well for the future and if the employee 'remains uncontactable' and has not been in touch since even just out of courtesy, swallow hard, as no one likes sacking anyone however badly behaved, and send them a weeks pay and another in loo of notice along with their P45.

Try again to find someone more genuinely committed to doing their best rather than someone who clearly didn't really give a damn and was just there for the money and was always going to let you down not just a question of if just when and the when would was gonna be when you needed them the most.

If the employee was being paid on a weekly basis I believe a weeks notice would be all that would be required on both sides in a probational period anyway. i would agree with Karl, sending in a text is hardly the way to act. Had she phoned up and had a proper conversation and at least sent in a self cert that would make things a teeny weeny bit more difficult.

If no more has been heard from her I would also just give the weeks notice with pay and back it up with a letter spelling out that she had not acted appropriately etc and see how she reacts. If all hell breaks loose you may have to put up with her for a bit longer whilst things are sorted.

Strictly speaking, there's still a disciplinary process that should be followed. However, the only thing the employee could claim for is wrongful dismissal if this wasn't followed, so your daughter would be advised to get some professional advice, and terminate the contract pretty much immediately; the employee may have a complaint for the wrongful dismissal, but the cost of settling this would be minimal, so worth settling to avoid any hassle if they do make a complaint.

Giving a week's notice & paying for this would be fine.

For the next employee, your daughter should also ensure she has a clear Statement of Particulars in place that can be issued to staff upon appointment. This would include details of the sick leave policy, and allow the employee to be dismissed if they didn't follow procedures - such as calling in to discuss the absence.

What timescale are you looking at? Is this the second week, is self-certification sufficiente? You say the employeee WAS on probation, have you both made your minds up already?
I appreciate your daughter needs cover to be elsewhere but with a part-time employee and a swine flu epidemic there's a need to be flexible. Notwithstanding the legalities of terminating the employment the practicalities are that the same thing could happen with a successor. A bird in the hand etc ......

The person contacted her by text half an hour before the start time, no sick note. The problem is my daughter needs this free time to attend courses look at new stock etc. she cannot do this with unreliable staff.

Any contract, procedures etc, has your daughter made contact, has a sick note been sent in?

My daughter has a small beauty salon, she has just employed an extra person on 20hours per week. The person worked the first week and then reported sick for the start of the second week. Can my daughter terminate her employment for unreliability? the person was on 3 months probation. She needs help knowing what is the righjt thing to do