Van Drivers

Lorraine

As a Van/Lorry Driver myself I can tell you our company follows LGV regulations for both LGV's and Vans. A good practice in my opinion.

You can have digital Tachographs retro-fitted to vans. Apply for a card and away you go.

Having undertaken a few long journeys in vans in the past, I can sympahise with your problem. We tend to bomb up the motorway at 80/90 without stopping untill we get to our destination.

All your employee has to do in common sense terms is have one break on the way up there and some dinner money.

Russell
I am sorry if i upset you that was not my intent as you can see Lorraine has one driver looking for training. I am sure you can understand i would not sent a very busy instructor to kent for what could be a classrom session. We are here to help each other i was just going to supply names of fleet instructors in that area. This would save Lorraine having to get the list from the D S A, as i said before we are here to help each other but please if you have a problem with any of my comment address them to me and dont leave sarcastic remarks.

Jim

We do advertising on here now!!!

Hi Lorraine
As a fleet driver trainer i am glad to see someone taking this matter Seriously. If you need help with this matter please send me a email and i will call you or if you want you can contact me 07774488160 or 01355231437.

Regards

Jim

Under the UK domestic regulations Vans and car derived vans under 3500kg mlw are limited to 10 hours driving and an 11 hour working day with some exemptions. There is no set break rule, but a 15 minutes break after 2 hours is recommended.

Vans over 2040kg are also restricted to 50 mph on A roads and 60 Mph on dual carriageways, another not well known piece of legislation.

This post has been removed because it contravened our guidelines.

The policy does not cover driving time limits. In the past we have just relied on poeple being sensible - but i think in this day and age, that is not acceptable.

I would prefer to have an addition on advanced training for the driver, that shows what is acceptable with regards to driving times and what are the dangers. At least then the driver has been made fully aware and whatever risks taken outside of this training/policy addition were at his own risk, and not the company, as we have take steps to prevent any accidents.

Have only just picked up this thread sorry. Do you have a policy on workplace driving? If you do does it state a maximum daily driving limit. If this is a one off every now and then i would suggest you put a limit on his days driving say 250 miles and add an extra day to the trip or as if possible have two sets of tools and fly / train the guy up there

And for sure not 'if' just a question of 'when' so still best to accept that there are a few "foreseeables" that need considering and see what reasonably practicable mitigative and positive guides may be introduced.

Talk to one's at risk as they are most likely to be able to describe potential hazards and if engaged in the process are more likely to adopt preventive measures as their own - simple'sss

HI Lorraine
To keep yourself right you should have a risk assessment done under H S E rules you are responsible. If something was to go wrong you could be help liable under the corparate manslaughter act.

Jim

He is unique James, he doesn't do that sort of trip often, and once he is up there he remains there for a couple of weeks. The type of tooling required is large and bulky, so other transport is out of the question.

The chap in question is not opposed to doing the journey, I just want to advise him the rules on doing the journey. He'll do it whatever way he wants, but I want to make sure we have given him enough information before he does this type of journey in the future.

Is this guy really so unique that he needs to do Kent to Aberdeen? Can you subcontract? This seems insane. Could you cost sending him (and a crate of tools) on the sleeper from Euston to Inverness/Aberdeen/Fort William then hiring a van from there?

I think the longest car drive I ever did was Sheffield-Edinburgh or Leeds-Axminster - and I wouldn't want to do either ever again. Train or plane everytime for me.

HGV rules were primarily put in place to protect members of the public, not the driver themselves, also recognising that vocational drivers will often be at the wheel throughout their working shift while car drivers usually only drive for short periods and short distances.

The risk to the vocational driver who is behind the wheel for the majority of the shift is more or less the same whether driving a 40 ton articulated truck or a smart car. Many employers therefore apply HGV principles when assessing the risk to their employees who are drivers.

Bear in mind also that employees can drive cars when they have significant medical problems that would prevent them from driving trucks. Underlying health problems must be included in any risk assessment you make, particularly conditions such as diabetes, heart disease and visual problems. Don't forget obesity; there are strong links between obstructive sleep apnoea and obesity, with the associated risk of falling asleep at the wheel. You suggest carrying out a 'medical'; make sure that whoever does the medical is appropriately qualified to do so (and the GP may not be appropriately qualified).

Tony

Thank you to everyone that has offered advice, its greatly appreciated.

As he does travel on his own, I will carry out a risk assessment and medical, and look at the fitted trackers.

Thanks again.

Hi Lorraine,

I've just linked into the forum during lunch (sad I know) and your situation/ question is similar to that of our own.
There are numerous rules and regulations - this is accepted eg, working time directive etc - however, IF your van is within 3500kg gross weight then it does not require a tachograph and therefore is not governed by the rules relating to HGV vehicles etc wherby there are strict guidelines.
The operative answer to your query is back to the age old "risk assessment".
As the employer you are vicariously liable under road transport regs and employment law to ensure a number of aspects.
Firstly - is the van road worthy, is it regualrly maintained, is it fit for purpose etc etc.
Secondly, have you carried out a risk assessment on the driver himself? I am not being paid by this web site but some time ago I bought the Driving at Work Policy from Workplace Law. We adapted it, published it to our drivers and most importantly, adapted the RA template and risk assessed all of our drivers.
The full answer here is that your driver is your responsibility. Is he also a lone worker - have you considered this? What are the cost implications of him having an assistant? The risk assessment should cover all manner of aspects of his journey including eye sight/ health and look at control measures.
There is no said rule that stops you from driving from Kent to Scotland if you were going on holiday - there is no rule that stops your employee doing the same - however his van is a place of work and this dictates that you take as many precautions as is necessary in order to prevent an accident.
Finally - we successfully fitted trackers to our vehicles. These high light speed, start times, stop times, durations etc. A great management tool.

HGV's have to work to the Working Time Directive and the UK Drivers Hours regs.
The drivers hours state that a driver needs to have 45 minutes break in or immediately after 4.5 hours driving. This can be a minimum 15 minute break then a 30 minute break or 45 minutes after 4.5 hours. No variation. The maximum working day can be 15 hours max, usually 13 hours, 9 hours driving maximum. The driver then needs to have a rest of at least 11 hours, which can be reduced to 9 hours three times a week.
The Working Time Directive requires that you have a minimum 30 minute break if you work 6 hours.

Hope this helps.

Check out the ROSPA website www.rospa.com as they have a secition on road safety that includes guidance for employers

Other than heavy goods vehicles that monitor driver activity most non-heavy goods upto 3 1/2 tonnes ? will be expected to be doing multiple drop work rather than long haul therefore, in this situation it would probably be best to complete a 'risk assessment' based on the particular task this driver is given.

This should include the risk of 'fatigue', visual acuity and 'given' driver needs for rest and/or comfort stops perhaps built into the drivers working shift pattern to allow some felxibility of choice to accommodate other variables like traffic delays extending time at the wheel or a clearer run leaving the driver to decide on a stop further up the road within time agreed between stops.

So, a little discussion, consultation with driver on the subject of risk and needs should result in a reasonably practicable and agreeable working framework in which the task or customer wants may be accomplished and driver risk reduced - reasonable and common sense.

It's him that we are transporting - he is a service engineer, he needs his van as it has his equipment, so we can't fly him up there.

Its not a regular situation, so its not something we have concerned ourselves with in the past, but it does worry me that we are putting him at risk by not letting him know what he can and can't do as far a travel to Scotland goes, once told if he chooses to do something different, then we would finf it difficult to prove, but I would like to make sure we are giving him as much advice as possible before these types of journeys are made.

Someone else may be able to help with specific driving requirements/regs but ....presumably his driving hours are included in his working hours, as they should be? Is there no better way of getting things North to South?

Does anyone know how many hours a driver of a van is allowed to do in one day? Is there a requirement for a specific amount of time for a break, and how do you monitor their travel times? We have an employee that drives from the Kent coast to the north coast of Scotland, he tries to do as much in one day as possible, then continues the next day - I am concerned that we allow him to do this, but are not considering the implications if he has an accident?

I appreciate any advice you can offer?